Cavalier King Charles Question

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  • #107401
    Daemonia
    Member

    I applaude you too, Wendy. Very well said! The stupid thing is as well, that those puppy farms sell the puppies cheaper than a good. registered breeder. That attracts a lot of people who dont want to spend much, still have a pedigree and havent got time or patience to wait for the right puppy.

    It’s a damn shame and very sad for all dogs concerned.

    Karina

    #107402
    Anonymous
    Guest

    They might think they save themselves some money when purchasing the puppy but the penny pinchers will have their wallets hit by vet bills later on you can almost guarentee it!! ::)

    #107403
    emma_pen
    Member

    Could anyone here REALLY take a puppy back to a terrible place once they had it?? I certainly wouldn’t have sent Haggis back into his hellhole… 😮

    #107404
    nala
    Member

    The money as people are suggesting was not a problem she was not trying to save money at all, she just didnt know about puppy farmers as stated.

    #107405
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Nala
    Give these to your friend does she think the PF is going to pay out this sort of money
    Sadly, the breed has a history of heart problems, but good breeders now screen for this and the Cavalier King Charles Spaniel Club is sponsoring a huge research project into this problem. Cavalier owners with the help of the regional clubs have raised huge amounts of money in the UK.

    Hearts- The heart scheme is run by the Cavalier King Charles Spaniel Club (www.thecavalierclub.co.uk ). The aim of the scheme is to reduce the incidence of mitral valve disease in the breed. Forms can be obtained from the Cavalier King Charles Spaniel Club and dogs can be tested either by a veterinarian or a cardiologist it is important to return the form to the research program in order that the scale of the problem in this breed can be accurately assessed. The information gathered is confidential.

    One of the main benefits of the scheme is that Cavalier King Charles Spaniel Club publish a list on their website of all dogs that have been tested after the age of 5 years old and found to be free of heart murmurs. As of May 2002 there were 705 animals listed. Current guidelines issued by cardiologists recommend that the minimum age for an animal to be used for breeding should be 2 and half years old with both parents clear at 5 years of age. Dogs who were clear at 5 years old should not be discounted from the breeding program if they then develop a murmur later in life.

    Endocardiosis

    Chronic valvular disease, or endocardiosis, accounts for 60 – 70% of acquired cardiac disease in dogs and in two thirds of cases; the left side of the heart is affected. It is most prevalent in small breeds, such as the Cavalier King Charles Spaniel and especially in male dogs.

    The valves of the heart, which prevent the blood being forced backwards when the heart muscle contracts, become thickened and leaky, so the pumping efficiency of each heartbeat is reduced. The flow of blood leaking backwards through the incompetent valve can often be heard though a stethoscope as a heart ‘murmur’. In mild cases, this regurgitation of blood may not lead to any clinical signs but as the cardiac output becomes more compromised, the dog will begin to show signs of heart failure.

    To make matters worse, the poor blood flow reaching the kidneys causes them to promote retention of salt and water, thus increasing the total blood volume that the heart must pump. This volume overload and pump failure leads to ‘congestive’ or ‘backward’ heart failure.

    Syringohydromyelia in
    Cavalier King Charles Spaniels (CKCS)
    Syringohydromyelia is also known as Chiari-type malformation (referring to human disease) and caudal occipital malformation syndrome.

    There is a genetic predisposition of CKCS to develop this neurological abnormality but it can also be seen in other breeds. The diagnosis of syringohydromyelia is now easily confirmed because MRI is more readily available for veterinary patients.

    What is syringohydromyelia ?
    Syringohydromyelia on its own is the presence of a cavity within the spinal cord parenchyma filled with cerebrospinal fluid (CSF : the fluid which is bathing the brain and the spinal cord), known as a syrinx. The reason why this cavity develops through time in some CKCS is mainly due to an abnormal conformation (shape) of the back of the skull (called the occipital bone).

    The caudal part of the brain (cerebellum) doesn’t have enough space in the occipital bone and tends to pass through the foramen magnum (exit hole of the spinal cord). This creates a pressure point, giving rise to an abnormal flow of CSF from the brain to the spinal cord. With time this flow disturbance can result in the formation of a syrinx. In some dogs, it can also cause a build up of fluid in the brain called hydrocephalus.

    What are the signs of syringohydromyelia ?
    Clinical signs can vary widely between dogs and no correlations have been found between the severity of syringohydromyelia and the severity of the clinical signs.

    The most common clinical signs are: twisting of the neck (scoliosis), stiff front limb gait, scratching of the neck and shoulder region, intermittent and unprovoked neck pain, atrophy of the neck muscles, weakness or lameness of the front limbs. They tend to appear with age and their evolution is usually progressive, but can be subacute in some cases.

    To complicate the matter, some dogs may present some syringohydromyelia on MRI without clinical signs. Other neurological diseases may give the same clinical signs.

    How is syringohydromyelia diagnosed ?
    The best way to diagnose syringohydromyelia is by means of MRI scanning. It is today the best imaging technique to evaluate the spinal cord parenchyma and the back of the brain. The abnormal bone conformation of the skull and the foramen magnum can be seen well with a CT scan (which is better designed to evaluate bone), but the information provided about the cerebellum and the spinal cord is less likely to show up than with MRI. On myelography, syringohydromyelia usually appears as a swollen cervical spinal cord.

    Picture 1 : MRI Image of the the brain (A) and spinal cord (B) of a normal dog. The red interrupted line indicates the level of the image (B).

    Picture 2 : Same MRI image of the brain (A) and spinal cord (B) and of an affected CKCS. The cerebellum descent toward the foramen magnum (1), the medulla is kinked (*) and a syrinx is present in the cervical spinal cord (2).

    Can you treat syringohydromyelia ?
    Both medical and surgical treatments have been described. There is no gold standard treatment for the moment in dogs although syringohydromyelia is considered as a surgical disease in man. Depending on the severity of the neurological signs and the age of the patient, a medical treatment is usually recommended in first intention.

    The most common drugs used are prednisolone, acetazolamide and gabapentin. The first two are meant to reduce the CSF production and swelling of the spinal cord. Gabapentin is an anti-epileptic drug used in dogs and humans to treat pain of nervous origin as well as ‘pins and needles’ sensation. In the absence of a response, a surgical treatment can be proposed.

    The aim of the surgical treatment is to restore a normal flow of CSF between the brain and the spinal cord by enlarging the foramen magnum dorsally. Performing the surgery early in the stage of the disease can slow or even stop the evolution of the syrinx.

    What is the prognosis of syringohydromyelia ?
    The evolution of syringohydromyelia is extremely variable between dogs. When clinical signs are present any treatment is more likely to stabilize the clinical signs or slow the course of the disease. As the formation of the syrinx is a slow process, degeneration of the spinal cord can occur at the same time and a complete recovery is unlikely to occur.

    It is difficult today to know about the overall prognosis of the surgical treatment, because of the few number of cases treated so far with this method.

    As I said in my first post this is a breed you should buy with great care
    I too would harden my heart and think of all the other pups this bastard will breed and would take the pup back this pup is only going to cause a lot of heartache
    Val

    #107406
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Nala i dont think anyone was suggesting that saving money was your friends motive  🙂

    #107407
    Anonymous
    Guest

    There is a slight difference here Emma this pup is already ill and as a breed they ain’t that healthy.
    Haggis has you and the resorces of your employer this poor woman has no chance of insurance for this pup and the never ending cost of high vet bills and could lose the dog anyway.

    I think this is just a tad different I don’t think people go to puppy farmers just to save money (some do) but a lot has to do with this must have NOW world we live in
    Val

    [quote author=emma_pen link=topic=2757.msg27090#msg27090 date=1143577127]
    Could anyone here REALLY take a puppy back to a terrible place once they had it?? I certainly wouldn’t have sent Haggis back into his hellhole… 😮
    [/quote]

    #107408
    Daemonia
    Member

    Nala … I didnt suggest that your friend wanted to save money. I said some people do. I think in your friends case it was exactly what Val said: Must have now!!! Otherwise she could have waited till you were back, dont you think?

    And also, just because the partial sightedness has been established and wont get better (there are dogs which live happily with that mind you) doesnt mean that the vet bills end. There are going to regular health checks and, as mentioned, added problems, most likely of the genetic kind. As was pointed out, King Charles are not the healthiest of breeds by all means. And yes, not being able to get insurance will rip somebody’s purse apart if the unexpected happens. Just having a blood test, ultra scan, anaestetic and cremation cost me around £350 for Max. If there had been any point, I would have gone for surgery, which would have run into the thousands. So insurance is a valid point.

    #107409
    emma_pen
    Member

    Oh yes this is completely different to Haggis – he was healthy for a start. But sstill, I couldn’t take a pup back to a puppy farmer – it would end up being drowned, battered, starved or worse. If you really weren’t going to keep it, it would be more humane to get it euthanased at the vets and not sent back for a horrible death.

    I think its more important to educate the world to stop people going to these bastards in the first place, not send tiny puppies back to them to die.

    #107410
    nala
    Member

    Thanks for the advice and i am sorry this seems to again have been such a debate. She is going to keep the puppy and she is prepared to pay whatever it costs should she need to insurance or not it is not going back to the puppy farmer ever.

    Louise

    #107411
    Daemonia
    Member

    Louise, although your friend did act wrong in the first place, I think she deserves a pat on the back now for keeping the pup and taking on all the responsibility that goes with it. Keep us updated how it is going, ok?

    Karina x

    #107412
    Anonymous
    Guest

    Well good luck to her if she needs any pointers just mail because I have a passion with dogs and I called her the T word does not mean I would not help her and the KC anyway I can, having lost one of my pekes a short time ago I know how the vets eat up money £1.800 in seven weeks just on bloods drugs and hospitalisation
    Val

    [quote author=nala link=topic=2757.msg27171#msg27171 date=1143628770]
    Thanks for the advice and i am sorry this seems to again have been such a debate. She is going to keep the puppy and she is prepared to pay whatever it costs should she need to insurance or not it is not going back to the puppy farmer ever.

    Louise
    [/quote]

    #107413
    nala
    Member

    Just thought i would give you an update this little pup is doing really well she is enjoying going on her walks and is really playing well with my friends other dog.

    Louise

    #107414
    kizkiznobite
    Member

    that is good news – thang doG – perhaps now she can catch up and have a good, long and happy life x

    #107415
    Anonymous
    Guest

    awww that is such great news ;D

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